Abortion

[Black Cat]

this seems to be another hot topic. I personally believe that a woman has the right to decide whether or not to carry a child. Lets say a high school student becomes pregnant. Are you telling her to have a baby?

Anyways i wanna see what everyone else thinks about this topic.

[SenbonZakura]

Personally I think abortion is wrong. But woman have the right to think for herself. She can decide whether she wants to have the baby or.....kill it.

[israellaa__x3]

I believe it's murder. I firmly believe it is wrong to kill a child like that. Selfish, actually.

If abortion was done only in life or death situations.. hm, I'm daydreaming again.

Oh look; it's free will.

[MangaAddict]

I think people are stupid if they get pregnant. But sometimes mistakes are made even if you use protection. I would never do it myself but I would never supress someones right to get an abortion whicch I believe is an even greater crime. If you make abortions illegal, girls will go somewhere to get it done that is unsanitary and unsafe resulting in their deaths as well. Plus you cant say with 100% certainty that that child will be happy with an adoptive family. Look at that lady who adopted all those kids for money and put them in cages. And dont forget couples who adopt only to have a child of their own sometime later, and then completely neglect their adopted child.
So, my opinion is, yeah it may be wrong in a way, but it certainly shoul not be illegal...

[Excel-Kleinwald]

There is always a possibility of an unborn's child life being good or bad after birth all dependant on outside influences and its own choices, we may not necessarily can guarantee that it would best or not for the child to be aborted because we can't see into the future to see what would happen to it but we can be pretty certain that it would ruin the parents' life and that environment could be harmful for the child. Sometimes it is being selfless to give up your unborn child instead of being selfish.

[flamboozie]

abortion is murder. thats all it is.
you wouldnt kill a child! thats the worst kind of murder! no i think its worse to kill an unborn child.
but hey everybody has a different opinion. but just remember. the baby you just killed could have changed the world in some dramatic way. but no. you killed it because you were a teenage girl! child teenager or adult. if u make a mistake, be prepared to except the conciquences.

[Excel-Kleinwald]

Yeah, it MIGHT have happened, but it isn't definite and what has been done is done. No use crying over spilt milk. Besides MOST abortions are done within a certain stage of pregnancy where it is considered not alive yet, it is just an egg and sperm formed together to make something that would eventually become a child.

[MangaAddict]

You cannot say that it could have changed the world...
But I do agree that after a certain point in pregnancy, abortions should be illegal. Women should get abortions before the third term. Anytime after that is disgusting...

[flamboozie]

You cannot say that it could have changed the world...
But I do agree that after a certain point in pregnancy, abortions should be illegal. Women should get abortions before the third term. Anytime after that is disgusting...

change the world! all i was saying was you never kno for sure. but whether its considered alive yet doesnt matter to me. if u were aborted and your current mind and soul (like your real mind and soul. how you think right now) came from your not yet life would you think, "i wasnt alive yet so it doesnt matter." or would you think "mother why did u kill me?" i would think the 2nd one i dunno about you tho...
i also happen to think that if a woman does not want the baby, she should take the punishment for her mistakes,(give birth to it) and then put it up for adoption.

[Excel-Kleinwald]

You know I wouldn't be here arguing with you right now if not for abortion.

[MangaAddict]

You know I wouldn't be here arguing with you right now if not for abortion.

Okay... what does that mean?

[Excel-Kleinwald]

If my mother had not had an abortion earlier in her life I wouldn't be alive now, simple as that.

[...]

well i guess ill put my two cents in
i dont think its wrong
there are so many different opinions
i think it should be done early in the stages
but if its outlaw people will do it illegaly...say a girl gets raped and has no choice and becomes pregnant do you really think she would want that baby...she will proably want to kill herself if she has the kid...and if you are a male you can be like peace especialy if it was a one night stand and you both barely remember each others names..fat chance she will hit you with an alimony check (not saying i ever did this to a girl that would be wrong) just drink responsibly and also in my opinion religion is a insufficent counter debate

[Yux]

Abortion is wrong put it up for adoption if you don't want it so that if has a chance to live and grow even if it means off it's own power

[DisturbedMind]

While I think it is morally wrong to terminate a human being before they've done anything to deserve it, I accept that women can choose whether or not to have him/her. But what I demand in that right is the responsibility of the mother to decide within a couple of months, before any organs have developed. If they aren't sure after 3-4 months, then it should be mandatory that they have the child, and then if they still don't want it, put it up for adoption. But there should be limits on this "right"; and yes, it hurts me to call it that.

and before anyone loses their marbles over this, I would make an exception for the mother's life. Not b/c it would cause her discomfort, not because it would cause her mental distress, and definitely not because it would hurt her a little. I'm talking about if she has the baby, she would either die, or have serious physical complications. We need to think about personal responsibility here people. What was she doing in the first place to need this abortion, huh. Maybe she should've thought of that, before she decided to snuff out the potential Einstein/Newton/Beethoven/etc. living in her stomach.

[death incarnate]

i believe that abortion is wrong. i agree that a woman can decide what to do with her body but if she is pregnant then i believe that counts as another body. Plus if they get pregnant because they sleep around too much then i believe that they should take responsiblity instead of the easy way out. I am not sure about rape though. i understand why you would want an abortion but i believe that all children start out as innocent.

[Ray]

well if the lady was ganna be left alone forced to pay for everything drop outta school yeah i think she should have the choice ^^

[Ichigo]

but does that mean you have to take the life of the child. while it is true everyone has been given the right to do as they please with there body its still wrong to never give an unborn child a chance at life Life is a precious gift that is given to us and we should never take that gift away yes there are difficult circumstances but ... I just don't think that is something for us to decide.

[Excel-Kleinwald]

Everybody talks as if it's just like taking a crap, you get it out and you're done. Well it isn't, it has the chance to be very harmful to the mother for doing this. And also, there is a point where the child becomes viable and I do not think it should be aborted after that, I say within the first trimester because I do not think it can be considered a life at that point in time.

[DisturbedMind]

the rape problem should be covered in her deciding withing a few months. I would think that she would take the morning after pill.

[`dead]

i believe that abortion is wrong. i agree that a woman can decide what to do with her body but if she is pregnant then i believe that counts as another body. Plus if they get pregnant because they sleep around too much then i believe that they should take responsiblity instead of the easy way out. I am not sure about rape though. i understand why you would want an abortion but i believe that all children start out as innocent.

I can't believe that such blatant misogyny isn't called out.

In my mind, I've really captured the credibility of the debaters in this forum when such brazen, ignorant comments are met with no resistance.

My opinion on abortion is that it should be allowed. Until a baby is born, it is a parasite in the mother's womb. However, I think that women should fully realize and accept that they are ending a life. really, it's a form of euthanasia-- an unwanted child often meets with terrible circumstances in their early life.

With that being said, there is absolutely no way to logically justify an abortion in the first trimester, opposed to the latter. murder is murder euthanasia is euthanasia.

Additionally, although people are so tired of hearing the "Christian" standpoint on issues like this, the best form of protection has been and will always be abstinence. Not only will you not get pregnant, but your chances for catching STIs drop dramatically to zero.

If you don't get pregnant until you actually want a child, then most of the body for this debate fizzles. However, I would like it to be noted that this applies to both sexes, not just the women. After all, women don't just magically get pregnant, men are equally responsible.

[DisturbedMind]

yes men are just as necessary, but they also have no rights whatsoever....so for all intents and purposes, in the context of pregnancy, men are nothing more than sperm production and delivery systems. As soon as men get the same rights to the fetus, such a a say as to whether it gets aborted, then I place all responsibility on the women.

[matt_itachi]

abortion is a crime but in God's eyes its murder...

thou shall not kill

abortion is simply killing...

but wat if they kept the child but the child died of hunger or something common like a disease because the parent are jst highskul stdnts the child will die either ways, to die in hinger or to die in abortion. very hard decision....what the use of condoms?

if i were you people i'll keep the child but...
send it to orphanage first and get him after you get a perfect job that the child will live a normal preppy life...

[Excel-Kleinwald]

abortion is a crime but in God's eyes its murder...

but wat if they kept the child but the child died of hunger or something common like a disease because the parent are jst highskul stdnts the child will die either ways, to die in hinger or to die in abortion. very hard decision....what the use of condoms?


First of all, as we were saying, in the first trimester it isn't even a life yet, it is still being formed and everything so how can you kill a non living being?

Secondly, You can't really say what will happen to the child since anything is possible. Who knows, maybe if you have the child it will be the king of the world, maybe it'll die of pneumonia.

[gr1mmy]

I have not views on abortion, but the people considering abortion should always think about their own values. Say, they don't get an abortion. Then the unwanted child is born. What do you do with him or her? Stick 'em in an orphanage, or foster, or something? Not very smart. Then again, abortion is basically like killing a living thing. Excel, if a fetus is not living, then how does it grow. It all depends on the mother's view.

[`dead]

First of all, as we were saying, in the first trimester it isn't even a life yet, it is still being formed and everything so how can you kill a non living being?



And as well all know, a magical switch flips after the 1st trimester that changes a developing fetus into a living being.

[Excel-Kleinwald]

obviously... but actually it grows into a living being. What are you gonna say your sperm and your egg were living things that had their own brains and such? No it was just a part of yourself as is the fetus as it is growing into a living being.

[`dead]

obviously... but actually it grows into a living being. What are you gonna say your sperm and your egg were living things that had their own brains and such? No it was just a part of yourself as is the fetus as it is growing into a living being.

Have you taken sex ed yet? Or perhaps you're in a church state and they're not allowed to teach these things in school.

Of course a spem is alive. It may just look like a little pile of white goo, but sperm are alive; while they may not possess conscience thought, they are still a livinf being.

[sorceritza]

ok guys... here it is: First of all, you shouldn't blame a woman for getting pregnant, because it's not quite her fault... men uncontrollable lose of their own sperm is to blame too. Second, the emergency pill can be taken only twice a year (that mean one in 6 months), because is a very toxic pill that affects a lot more organs not only the small creatures in the sperm. Third of all: that thing that a woman wants to get rid of (if that's the case), doesn't even has a heart until the sixth week of pregnancy. The limit to perform an abortion is max 3 months, otherwise the pregnant woman is at risk. So, i don't consider it a murder if the abortion is made in max. 6 weeks. Besides, to make an abortion is as painful as it is to give birth to a child, not to mention the psysical and psychic disorder afterwards. so don't judge a woman for her choice. She is not the only one to take responsibility, and yet she is paying the price 10 times more than a male. Fair?

[Excel-Kleinwald]

Well sorceritza put it better than I did. And yes of course the male is at least equally responsible for the child's creation and should take responsibility as well, but they aren't the ones who are pregnant so unfortunately they often run out on the woman.

About sperm, yes they move on their own and such. But that kind of being I don't consider a living being because of its insignificance. You aren't going to say you don't want sperm to be killed because it's murder are you? If so that would be pretty scary, it would make ejaculation sound like genocide.

[sorceritza]

=)) I definitely don't consider sperm a living thing!!! hahahahahaha

[Useless]

abortion should be allowed.
it does not matter if it is a crime in gods eyes.
i for one am atheist so that would not matter to me.
in the first trimester they arent alive, they are developing from its would be parents dna.
meaning it isnt alive, it isnt murder, and even if it was it is the decision of the parents.

[negitoro]

Of course a spem is alive. It may just look like a little pile of white goo, but sperm are alive; while they may not possess conscience thought, they are still a livinf being.
In that case, guys commit murder everytime they masturbate.

Better arrest me now.

[urburstingmybubble]

i believe abortion is wrong if it was your own fault, ie you were too stupid to have sex and not use protection. then its your own fault and it is unfair to punish something which your fault and due to your stupidity.

but on the other hand i believe abortion is ok if the mother was raped because she didnt want the child and couldnt take any action to prevent it. also if she keeps the child then she may resent it and it could have a horrible life. also i think abortion is ok if the child has got a serious or physical disability and the quality of life for the child would be horrible, both to the parents and to the child

overall though i think its an issue that depends on the situation and i dont really think you can judge it unless you are facing the possibility.

[Qcks]

well....

I'm pro-choice, not that it really matters since i'm a guy.

Right to life's agitate me because, almost universally i've noticed an in-consistancy; Right-to-Lifers are usually the first to preach giving the child up for adoption, but the last to actually adopt a child. Simply put, if you want my attention, practice what you preach.

[negitoro]

i believe abortion is wrong if it was your own fault, ie you were too stupid to have sex and not use protection. then its your own fault and it is unfair to punish something which your fault and due to your stupidity.

but on the other hand i believe abortion is ok if the mother was raped because she didnt want the child and couldnt take any action to prevent it. also if she keeps the child then she may resent it and it could have a horrible life. also i think abortion is ok if the child has got a serious or physical disability and the quality of life for the child would be horrible, both to the parents and to the child

overall though i think its an issue that depends on the situation and i dont really think you can judge it unless you are facing the possibility.This makes no sense.

So it's OK if the child has a disability which would cause suffering on the parents? So if someone carelessly concieved a child, you don't think that the child and parents would cause just as suffering on all of them? An unwanted child, regardless of the circumstances of his conception, suffers.

Besides, how are we to judge what is stupid? Like what if someone was inadequately educated and just didn't understand the consequences? What if someone tried 'contraception' by using rhythm methods (sex during times of infertility) or withdrawing before male ejaculation? More importantly, what if contraception fails? Condoms break, birth control pills fail, etc. None of it is 100%.

Will there be someone at the abortion clinic who does a hearing and giving stamps of approval of whether your situation was or was not due to stupidity?

[VelvetRose]

i would never consider having an abortion but i think it shud b legal.
first off... it's the woman's body n shud b allowed 2 do what she pleases with it. WOMENS RIGHTS!
second... how could a guy who will never experience pregnancy decide for a woman what she can and cannot do with her body. personally i think it should b a womans vote on the legalization or illigalization of abortion.

[mexicanopunk]

I just got done watching the news they said that a man is going 2 jail on 2!!!!! accounts of murder. One of a lady and the other is of a 7 month unborn child.So what im trying 2 say is why isnt abortion murder in the eyes of the law but only at 7 months or more its muder in the eyes of the law.

[Pookiez]

Abortion is wrong put it up for adoption if you don't want it so that if has a chance to live and grow even if it means off it's own power

Yeah and make a woman worry about her child that is growing up somewhere but she has no contact with? And what is the point of bringing a human being into this world where overpopulation is a serious issue?

[Pookiez]

I just got done watching the news they said that a man is going 2 jail on 2!!!!! accounts of murder. One of a lady and the other is of a 7 month unborn child.So what im trying 2 say is why isnt abortion murder in the eyes of the law but only at 7 months or more its muder in the eyes of the law.

Because at earlier stages, the fetus' have not developed a brain/conscious yet.

[Excel-Kleinwald]

Yeah and make a woman worry about her child that is growing up somewhere but she has no contact with? And what is the point of bringing a human being into this world where overpopulation is a serious issue?

The point of bringing a human being into the world is either an accident, or on purpose, simple as that. And there is only an overpopulation in certain areas of the world, but what are you going to do? Force people to stop having children? Well you can't do that, and then by the time the population gets down to a "reasonable" level we will all most likely be too old to bring anymroe children into the world.

[Useless]

I just got done watching the news they said that a man is going 2 jail on 2!!!!! accounts of murder. One of a lady and the other is of a 7 month unborn child.So what im trying 2 say is why isnt abortion murder in the eyes of the law but only at 7 months or more its muder in the eyes of the law.

they wouldnt be allowed to abort a fetus at 7 months

[sorceritza]

besides, the woman decided to keep the child, and the accused man tried to kill her with her child. If the woman decided not to keep it, she would have get rid of the child at least 4 months before. But even if he tried to kill her in the beginning, when the child was only 6 weeks the man would still be accused of murder, if she decided to keep it. It seems fair...

[hehey]

abortion = murder, and if you dont want kids then use a condom or better yet abstinance(i dont practice it, but if your realy scared about having kids then do).



but im not a girl, so my opinion means nothing.

[sorceritza]

:)) How can you be that trenchant? (abortion=murder). You sound like you are 14...

[hehey]

im 16, and killing = killing no mater how you word it.

[Excel-Kleinwald]

You can't kill what isn't alive.

[hehey]

im prety sure unborn babies are alive.

[Excel-Kleinwald]

After a certain point they DO become viable, but before that they aren't, it isn't like they just appear and TADA! You've got a whole live baby in the mother's womb for a whole 9 months.

[negitoro]

im prety sure unborn babies are alive.
During the early stages of pregnancy when most abortions would occur, they're not even babies.

They're not babies anymore than eggs or sperm.

Again, if those count as human lives, then men commit unspeakable crimes everytime they masturbate or have sex with a condom. Women kill everytime they don't have sex to prevent their period.

[sorceritza]

im prety sure unborn babies are alive.

My opinion is that before making a statement like this one, you should check for aviable information on this field. If you don't have the time necessary, then just read the whole thread. I posted on the first page about when the baby actually becomes a living thing... And then you should talk about murders...

[Angel Diary]

i support abortion if its before the third trimester.

i hardly call it murder if the "baby" is just a speck or the size of a walnut

[lovedangelchild]

I think that even you put names like 'fetus' on a baby, it's STILL a baby. It just makes you feel better when you call it a fetus 'cause it doesn't feel like your killing a human when your getting that abortion. A life is a life no matter how small it is. Women have the right to do with there body, to take care of the baby or kill it. Thats what abortion is. Killing of a human life LEGALLY and I don't think... No I KNOW it's not right.

[Excel-Kleinwald]

It isn't the fact that it is small that makes it not a human, it is the distinct lack of self sustained life signs of the thing. It is not living it is still growing into what it will become, it will become a life, but it was not always a life.

[negitoro]

I think that even you put names like 'fetus' on a baby, it's STILL a baby. It just makes you feel better when you call it a fetus 'cause it doesn't feel like your killing a human when your getting that abortion. A life is a life no matter how small it is. Women have the right to do with there body, to take care of the baby or kill it. Thats what abortion is. Killing of a human life LEGALLY and I don't think... No I KNOW it's not right.

During the early stages of pregnancy, there's nothing that even resembles what we could consider a baby. Where exactly is the distinction made? Isn't the egg a small life? Isn't the sperm? Are you telling me we're killing when those are wasted?

It's sort of like, if you went into a restaurant and ordered a chicken and was served an egg, you'd make a fuss. Isn't the the same thing though - after all, the egg would've eventually become the chioken.

[sorceritza]

like I said before: before making statements please do a minimum (medical, not religious, not philosophic) research. Then you can state what is a baby or a fetus, or whatever you like to state. And then, if your statements still stay the same, only then you can call it an opinion. ok, lovedangelchild?

[Tenchi]

now im still not sure of my own opinion on this one.
I am a firm believer that a featus has no awarness that it is going to be alive, and I believe it is not yet a living thing therefor not a baby.

But on the other hand

I would know that in a few months it would be, my baby, his baby, who everes baby, in just a few months it would be a baby.

So I think it depends on the circumstances, say if you were 14 and found out you were pregnant by being stupid or suffering a rape attack, or suffer from hiv e.t.c- I think abortion would be reasonable, it wouldnt be fair on the baby to be mothered by such a young person and fathered by an adolesance or an evil man or born with a sever disability- and adoption is just as cruel in my books - id go mental if my parents werent my real ones.

but I think if you take nessesry precoutions not to have a baby then hopefully this wont be an issue.

if your 25, had a one night stand, thats your own fault if you get pregnant.

gaaah I just dont know were I stand on this one.

I think if your stupid and old enough then abortion shouldnt be an option, but if your young and stupid, old and severly disabelled, or suffer pregnancy due to rape then I think its a viable option to take.

[negitoro]

But that kind of indecisiveness doesn't work in reality. Like I said before, who's to decide on who is stupid? Is there some judge at the door of the clinic giving hearings?

[Tenchi]

your stupid if you get pregnant because your drunk or if you have un protected sex at an old or early age - espescialy if you dont want a kid at that time - that good sir makes you stupid!

[Enjoying Ur Death]

wow u people really had a heated discussion. in turn i believe it's not wrong to have an abortion. some say that u should just give birth to the child and put it up for adoption, but u really don't know how many children there r in orphanges right now cause people do not want to adopt another person's child although some do cause they can't have their own kid or don't want to. then there is the fact that there r some evil men out there that go around raping women causing them to get pregnant,so as a woman u don't want to have the child and raise it knowing that it will soon grow up to look like the horrible person raped u,then again there is the fact that some do conceive the child and put it up for adoption but all that does is put another child in a place where they won't recieve parental love. as for sleeping around and or being drunk, a woman should know when not to have sex or at least make perfect sure to use protection. in all a woman's body is her own. she is the one tht has to carry the child so she alone has the right to choose what is to become of that life.

[elemental]

I understand whats being said by when the fetus is first considered a baby. And I understand where all the medical lingo comes in. And I don't want to really cause any kind of fight here. But the point is that even though it shows no sign of life, it's still something that's growing inside. And when people say it's not at least some form of life, it sound like there just calling it a parasite or something. Now I know people have the right to choose whether they want to have an abortion or not. And I will say that I don't approve. And I'm aloud my opinion. As is anyone who does approve of it. And I would never bash anyone who's had it done. It's a choice. But it's always the people who have it done and then have emotional breakdowns about it afterwards because they decided too late that they shouldn't have done it. I'm just saying if you are going to do it, make sure it's really what you what to do. Sorry if I don't make much sense, I usually have too many thoughts running through my head at once.

[Sniper]

The only difference between a fetus and a parasite is that a fetus has the potential to become something better. A parasite won't change.

While I think that abortion is wrong as a form of birth control, I support people's right to choose. A seed is not a flower, even if it's begun to sprout.

[ghassassin]

Something which is unseen and unborn is as good as a non living thing. Destroying it or waiting for it to acquire life, should be a personal decision. A fetus doesn't enjoy the fundamental rights of a regular citizen, so there is nothing "murderous" in abortion.

[Onslaught King]

Something which is unseen and unborn is as good as a non living thing. Destroying it or waiting for it to acquire life, should be a personal decision. A fetus doesn't enjoy the fundamental rights of a regular citizen, so there is nothing "murderous" in abortion.

Oooookaaayyyy.....then let's say your the unborn, lifeless, unseen fetus. "Nurse bring in the next test subject, please!!!" :p

[Sniper]

If I'm an unborn, lifeless, unseen fetus, I wouldn't care.

[Useless]

For those of you who think abortion is murder, I'm gonna ask you if you've hit puberty. If an unborn chance at life being "killed" is bad, well....I hope you have a lot of self control. I don't feel like being more clear than this. >_>

Anyways, there is a reason that they only allow abortions before the first trimester. (Or whenever they stop allowing it. I don't remember. Plus, I learned it from an episode of SP. I don't read up on abortion all too often. /ramble.) Its because thats when it becomes alive or something. Like what I said during that short ramble, I don't really know. I do know that the baby is not alive right after conception. Not for a while after conception. Thats why they abort it. When they are alive. They don't. Because it is alive. Not too difficult of a concept.
You know, unless its wrong. I've just assumed all of this. >_>

[Onslaught King]

For those of you who think abortion is murder, I'm gonna ask you if you've hit puberty. If an unborn chance at life being "killed" is bad, well....I hope you have a lot of self control. I don't feel like being more clear than this. >_>

Anyways, there is a reason that they only allow abortions before the first trimester. (Or whenever they stop allowing it. I don't remember. Plus, I learned it from an episode of SP. I don't read up on abortion all too often. /ramble.) Its because thats when it becomes alive or something. Like what I said during that short ramble, I don't really know. I do know that the baby is not alive right after conception. Not for a while after conception. Thats why they abort it. When they are alive. They don't. Because it is alive. Not too difficult of a concept.
You know, unless its wrong. I've just assumed all of this. >_>

Then maybe you should read up on abotion a little more before you join in on the growns up conversation. Now run along we're talking okay!?!:lol:

[Onslaught King]

If I'm an unborn, lifeless, unseen fetus, I wouldn't care.

Then we wouldn't be talkin to you now would we!?!;)

[Useless]

Then maybe you should read up on abotion a little more before you join in on the growns up conversation. Now run along we're talking okay!?!:lol:

Then we wouldn't be talkin to you now would we!?!;)

Yup. I can see how my ineptitude is so very apparent in this conversation. My apologies. I really wish that you could possibly forgive my ignorance, as I was blinded by the fact that....I don't even feel like finishing this. So...I'll tell it to you in a nutshell. "No. Shut up. :)"

On to what could roughly be considered debatable material...
If he was aborted, then your right. He wouldn't be here. However, he wasn't. That doesn't prove anything. I guess I messed up when I said it was "roughly" debatable. It isn't.

[ghassassin]

Oooookaaayyyy.....then let's say your the unborn, lifeless, unseen fetus. "Nurse bring in the next test subject, please!!!" :p

I wouldn't have known anything, if I happened to be that unborn fetus. Or were you there as a fetus till you turned 15?

[Enjoying Ur Death]

all of u need to go jump off a bridge. u get three months to abort and then maybe two to three months after cuz it's only towards the last months that the baby shows any signs of life.

[Useless]

I don't see where the bridge comes in..this isn't the suicide thread. >_>
Anyways, you seem to not know how long women are pregnant after conception. You took into account the first 3 and last 3 months. Thats 6. (3+3=6) Human women are pregnant for nine months. (3+3+3=9)

[Onslaught King]

I wouldn't have known anything, if I happened to be that unborn fetus. Or were you there as a fetus till you turned 15?

I didn't really grasp your comment. Were you like trying to call me childish or something? But anywayz all I'm tryin to say is that a unborn fetus could be the next scientist who cures cancer or even aids. Think about the possiblities before we start to stick things with needles.

And I haven't forgotten about you Mr. Useless. I'll see you in the Naruto RP.:D

Lights out kiddys!!!!!:p

[Useless]

No you won't. Why would you? I'm not in it.
Anyways, yea. They might be the next great scientist. Or, in the far more enjoyable option, they could be the next Hitler. Or Stalin. Etcetera.
You can't judge life in something that has none.

[scoop]

abortion if done because of the mother's poor health, rape, incest, poor financial conditions to support another life, then i would say abortion is fine.
but if its done because of an unwanted pregnancy or because of reasons of getting rid of it, then that's disgusting and extremely wrong.

so what if the foetus isn't alive and blah blah, its the beginning of a life. it so ironical that the world has become so superbly practical and materialistic, that we are forgetting that every life has the right to live(even if its just a foetus)

even if abortion of any kind is acceptable to the society, and the right is given only to the mother, on an emotional basis, killing of a foetus for purely selfish reasons is horrible.

but then, world doesn't run on emotions nowadays, so there shouldn't be any value to any kind of life.

[Onslaught King]

No you won't. Why would you? I'm not in it.
Anyways, yea. They might be the next great scientist. Or, in the far more enjoyable option, they could be the next Hitler. Or Stalin. Etcetera.
You can't judge life in something that has none.

I feel you on that, but I believe the risk of losing something that important with so many unknown variables can't be passed up? Yes, someone could say the same about stem cell research, but what if they accidentally produce a man made disease? Kinda unlikely sure,but in the right enviornment yes. I believe a child has a better chance at a enviornmentally safe life than the experiments produced through research.

Peace out!!!!!

[Useless]

Yea. They have a 100% better chance to live an environmentally safe life. Since...fetuses aren't alive. They are unborn...

Yup. Why let other people cure diseases? Only the baby in a certain persons womb can cure AIDS. Not anyone else. So lets risk thousands of people dying under a dictator to maybe get that a bit faster. Or not. :)

[Sniper]

Ok, every fetus will only be one thing. A baby. And babies are worthless, plus the smell.

That said, potential life is not life. It's only potential. Masturbation isn't murder is it? Periods aren't murder, right? We have over six billion people on this earth. Rather than make new ones, we should focus on keeping the existing ones alive. This means we need embryos for stem cell research. Using this, we could cure cancer and AIDS now, rather than pray that the baby will randomly be a super doctor.

[Onslaught King]

Ok, every fetus will only be one thing. A baby. And babies are worthless, plus the smell.

That said, potential life is not life. It's only potential. Masturbation isn't murder is it? Periods aren't murder, right? We have over six billion people on this earth. Rather than make new ones, we should focus on keeping the existing ones alive. This means we need embryos for stem cell research. Using this, we could cure cancer and AIDS now, rather than pray that the baby will randomly be a super doctor.

Ooohhh i seeee, keep everyone who's living alive now, but um oh yeah WHAT IF WE CAN'T REPRODUCE? Past diseases from scientific experiments have been proven to have that effect. Masturbation and periods aren't murder, because it's apart of nature unlike killing something with your bare hands.

"Why cure now when you can wipe it all out later?"

[Useless]

Well....to your first paragraph, WTFH ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?! Not being able to reproduce? I don't think anyone needs to regrow a penis or other genitals...Also, if something that could be life, ie sperm and eggs, being discharged isn't murder, then how is abortion murder? I'm pretty sure masturbation is done with a hand. Unless you have telepathy, then it is...

Also, for the quote. Why? Because people will die. Lots of them. That is, in most cultures, very bad.

[ghassassin]

I didn't really grasp your comment. Were you like trying to call me childish or something? But anywayz all I'm tryin to say is that a unborn fetus could be the next scientist who cures cancer or even aids. Think about the possiblities before we start to stick things with needles.


And what if it turns out to be Osama bin Laden?
Well whatever, your argument is futile and baseless. Placing hopes on something which doesn't even exist is what else but childish. Abortion is a personal decision and you don't stand a chance against it.

[methaniel]

Aborption is a choice made by the mother, and it's not a slightly decision to make...even if this child wasn't wanted, it can be a trauma for the mother. However, I'm in favor of this, since an unwanted baby can bring sadness both to the mother and the baby, since he may no live a good life.
For the masturbtion thing...that don't have anything to do, sperms is just a germinal cell, it's like saying you kill something when you cut yourself since cell are destroyes. For the periods, it's not really related to anything, since it's something natural. Well, that have nothing to do with this subject.
And for using these embryos...curing AIDS or cancer isn't related to that isn't it? Embtyos can help for the stem cell research, but noy the AIDS. For the cancer, maybe they find a way of stoping the production of stem cells (basically a cancer is a cell that mute in a stem cell and multply herself randomly). But AIDS is a virus...where is some link between this?

[EightySix]

abortion is acceptable under some circumstances..rape victims with an unwanted child that should be a priority..whereas abortion after consented sex is debatable..some parents or teenagers may not have the money or time to raise a child.

by the way i agree with ghass...abortion is a very personal decision and it is no concern of yours even if that child was destined to be the next albert einstein. although..come to think of it...albert einstein created the atom bomb therefore he turned out to be a much more dangerous man than osama :)

[MoonSideMKDS]

I'm really biased on this subject because of a past expierance, long story short, my mother was going to put an end to yours truely before I even got the chance to see the world, if it weren't for the rest of my family members setting up an intervention, i wouldn't be here writing this...

but to say that abortion wrong is just me being selfish, my mother was having a rough time being a single mother so I don't really blame her for not wanting another child, but at the same time, it's entirly her fault for getting knocked up in the first place.

I had a discussion about this awhile ago in which I reached my final conclusion,

Abortion should be allowed under certain circumstances and vice versa.

If a girl is raped and is pregnant with a child, I believe the abortion is justified.

If the girl is a stupid whore who thinks she can have her way in life 24/7, no way in hell is the abortion justified.

Adoption = Pure BS. People who put their children up for adoptions are making a huge mistake.

[methaniel]

Yeah, I pretty much understand you. I'm in the same case, my mother was pregnant at 18 and single of course. She didn't abort and I'm gratefull for this, but if she had, I can understand. And yeah, aborption is good in the case of an unwanted child, rape, or maybe too young people (in this case...they could have been more prudent though)

[ghassassin]

You wouldn't have existed to care or lament about it, if in the first place you hadn't been born. Looking at it from the "unborn" child's perspective is just impractical.

[EmoEmu]

all I'm tryin to say is that a unborn fetus could be the next scientist who cures cancer or even aids. Think about the possiblities before we start to stick things with needles.


i wouldnt know, but i kinda doubt thats what a woman about to abort her fetus would be thinking. seriously, i dont think its that simple.

[Sniper]

aborption

Uh, there's no "p." That's the second time you've done that, so I'm starting to think it's on purpose...

Anyways, I think even if it's the mothers fault, if the baby will completely ruin the mom's life, then is's ok. But in general, I am against it. I still think it should be allowed though.

[methaniel]

...it was made on purpose, I don't know why I think of this "p"
Oh, and today, I happen to learn that in Hippocrate's... I don't know the word in english you use, you know what every doctors have to say before being one...well in this text, you say that you'll never give someone meds that would way him (the patient) to death, nor you'll give a woman any abortive help...so basically doctors "cannot" make abortion, and some by respect for what they said won't do it
(I don't know if it was actually said, I'm too lasy for reding all the post actually sorry)

[Sniper]

Ah, I see you're from France. In that case, I forgive your bad English. I thought you were American at first, so I commented on it.

I'm not entirely sure what that post was saying, but I know that doctors are allowed to perform abortions and that they are allowed to use drugs to help the mother get through the abortion. They put the mom to sleep.

Another method of abortion: straight punch to the gut.

[Tyrrel87]

Ah, I see you're from France. In that case, I forgive your bad English. I thought you were American at first, so I commented on it.

I'm not entirely sure what that post was saying, but I know that doctors are allowed to perform abortions and that they are allowed to use drugs to help the mother get through the abortion. They put the mom to sleep.

Another method of abortion: straight punch to the gut.

In USA don't doctors take the Hippocrate oath?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hippocratic_Oath

Here it's common...

[Playmore]

Hippocratic oath is out of date eventough they are using it everywhere still.

This next declaration is an update revision of the oath and much more understandable for doctors and normal people:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaration_of_Geneva

the debate on doctor helping or not for abortion is something that should be in an other thread.

[rainingblood666]

I say it is up to the situation the mother is going to be in. Abortion should be the last possible choice she can make; if she cannot afford to take care the baby, nor can she support the baby because of its situation. But again it should be the last possible choice.

[ghassassin]

In some cases where the mother isn't medically sound to carry the child or to prevent possible miscarriages and all, doctors do recommend abortion. So, abortion shouldn't only be related to just "dropping the unborn child".

[silvernekokitsune]

well i think it depends on how far in the pregnancy a woman is. i think the egg becomes a baby when you can recognize a heart beat otherwise it is just another cell in the body. but also someone has to think weather the child would have a good life. what if the mother is a carrier for a genetic disease? there is a possibility that the child could live the rest of their life suffering. and if they give birth to that child what kind of life would they live. granted this is coming from the mouth of a 13 yr old and i've never gone through that experiance so i don't really understand what it's like. you people who say that it's wrong would you say that if you or your girlfriends were going through that?

[methaniel]

Ah, so that's call an oath fo hippocrate, okay. Yeah, that's what I was referring, and even if it's now really old (so boring to study it), some beliefs are still usable now, and some doctors (rare), are really respectfull to this oath, so they won't perform any abortion, or euthnasie. But let's say, most of doctors aren't that respectfull for it, and don't really care perform it or not.
And the staight punch to the guts...made me think of one pic in the "Don"t laugh..." thread with Zelda

[EmoEmu]

Ah, so that's call an oath fo hippocrate, okay. Yeah, that's what I was referring, and even if it's now really old (so boring to study it), some beliefs are still usable now, and some doctors (rare), are really respectfull to this oath, so they won't perform any abortion, or euthnasie. But let's say, most of doctors aren't that respectfull for it, and don't really care perform it or not.
And the staight punch to the guts...made me think of one pic in the "Don"t laugh..." thread with Zelda

about the oath, i remember reading something that said something along the lines of abortion being alright cause the hippocratic oath refers to harming people and that until like the second trimester that thing in your uterus isnt considered a human yet but a cluster of developping cells. and that abortions after some time (the time it takes for it to get some form of human "life") is illegal cause it would violate the code/oath... and thats why it isnt before then murder either.
i dont know how accurate that is though, if at all. has anyone else heard that?

[methaniel]

I actually studied this oath two days ago, and it refers to not give anything that will lead someone to death (euthanasie), and I think it was some phrase like this too for the aborption (at least, it really speak about it...wonder how did thy do at this time?). But well, it's not as if this oath really is that important now

[SweetSourYum]

abortion is a sin,murder, and a regret... bc of their unwillingly choice to get pregnant then regret it women r like sinners...its bc they have boyfriends and they get seduced by them into this situation and this is how babies always never make it... some mothers want a baby and try to have one but it ends up with false pregnancy,miscarriage,or barren fertility that's y adoption helps at least

[ghassassin]

and this is how babies always never make it...

Do you have any idea about the population of this planet? No wonder, you think like a caveman.

[shinigami52493]

Me no like abortion, me think its murder. Its very wrong and disturbing. I dont think it matters if she gets raped, if shes raped shes raped, just because someone did an injustice to her doesnt mean that she should punish the child for that. It does not matter if it isnt born yet, its still wrong. If i were a girl and i aborted a child, then i would die from my concience. And people that are saying, they could be born to do great things, well they could do that or they can cause destruction. It doesnt matter to me, still think that it is immoral an wrong. I dont care if anyone dissagrees with me, i just think living with that on ur chest would be just like dieing. And i see that when i said the thing about it can grow up to be a evil person, i dont care if that sounds hypocritical and stuff. Those be my thoughts.

[ayashi]

I only use the word "murder" for human beings.
A foetus, is not , in my book, one. It (notice the use of IT) might become one someday, but at the moment considered for abortion, it is not one yet. Actually it is less than an animal for it is incapable of self sustainment. It is just a part of the woman/girl body.
Judging a situation for what might happen, is as illogical as imprisoning someone because (s)he might commit a crime!

[SilverKunai]

I thought this was settled when Suzuka ended. >>

Apparently not.

Anyhow.. I think abortion really depends on your current position. I would say more.. but.. I really don't have much to back it up.

[miavizard]

its more despicable that killer nowaday..at least they kill people n face them..i dun care the weapon though~i mean..can u kill baby?how could u??i got cousin..she pregnant when she 16..they decide to clean it..but she refuse to..do u know what happen to that baby now?she's my niece..n she healthy baby..damn cute..u know..if her mum decide to kill her..she wont be here..n im against abortion..because u can face physical damage..but not mentally..u can choose for adoption..theres no need to kill them..but....generally..think before u DOING it..that baby dont need to suffer because of their parents..
so..its big NO!!!
[sorry..im bit emotional when it comes to baby..*they cute!!*]

[Drunkenvalley]

77% of those against abortion are men.. 100% of those will never be pregnant.
Does this bring up an interesting point for you? :P

I hear a lot of people saying "Abortion is killing a human".. but you know..

Women usually live up into their 80s, and women on average have children by the age of 26.
Most women that take abortion are below the age of 20, or still studying.

Once with a living child in their arms, mothers usually take care of their children for the rest of their life, oftentimes quitting any sort of career to be with the kids. To take care of them.

Men usually live up into their 70s at best, and do not ever give birth themselves, though they usually have a child with their partner before they're 40. They usually spend only a few weeks with the kids at a time, mostly staying at work. And when not at work, they usually spend most of their time idling around or spend it with their kids.

My point? Womens live longer than men, but spend roughly 3/4 of their lives just taking care of their child(ren) in one way or another.

So I ask of you, how is it that people say a woman doing her first delivery before she's 30 is not killing a person as well?
(I say first delivery because once a woman has one, their lives are already usually slightly compromised. Of course, with more and more children, their lives are even more compromised.)

[miavizard]

man..the way u saying..
its good to be man huh?
i dun mind my life is short..i just want to be happy..
haha..but thanx for my mum im breathing now..uhm..my dad also..ahaha
im not goin to waste my life..coz my mum spend 3/4 her life taking care of me..
^_^im glad she decide to give birth to me n my lil bro..
please..dont kill the feotus~

[Drunkenvalley]

Hehe. I just decided to get a point across: Women's lives is often basically going to school, then somewhere during or shortly after become pregnant. Because of the child they may quit the job, or have hardly any free time at all. Effectively you have killed her opportunity to prove herself "just as worthy as a man".

This is why I'm thinking that women should always be able to decide, during pregnancy, whether to keep the child or not, as they are frankly put the ones that handle the children the most in more ways than one. :)

[miavizard]

i assume that ur man huh?
yeah..its individual rights..
geez..im better taking care of myself..
if u got kid someday,u better help ur wife taking care of him!!dun make ur wife spend her lifetime..do it together..endure the pain together..share half of lifetime together..ahahaha..
but still..no for abortion...
all baby is cute..>_<

[Drunkenvalley]

I am a male indeed. :)

I'm saying that if the woman doesn't want the kid, then she should be able to decide whether to have it or not. It's that simple, really.

[Drunkenvalley]

Yes, it is an individual matter. :) But a lot of people are trying to fight to have abortion completely removed as an option. Mostly males from what I hear, of course, who usually wants to reproduce and be done with it. >_>

[Beccav]

My opinion on abortion is that it should be allowed. Until a baby is born, it is a parasite in the mother's womb. However, I think that women should fully realize and accept that they are ending a life. really, it's a form of euthanasia-- an unwanted child often meets with terrible circumstances in their early life.

With that being said, there is absolutely no way to logically justify an abortion in the first trimester, opposed to the latter. murder is murder euthanasia is euthanasia.

Additionally, although people are so tired of hearing the "Christian" standpoint on issues like this, the best form of protection has been and will always be abstinence. Not only will you not get pregnant, but your chances for catching STIs drop dramatically to zero.

If you don't get pregnant until you actually want a child, then most of the body for this debate fizzles. However, I would like it to be noted that this applies to both sexes, not just the women. After all, women don't just magically get pregnant, men are equally responsible.[/QUOTE]


If life doesn't begin at conception, when does it start? That's when it starts...That means that abortion at any time is murder--not of a parasite but of a baby... and babies as young as four months premature have been saved and grown into beautiful children.

Of course you can't guarentee what the future would be for a child that has been adopted out--you can't guarentee the future of a wanted child either. And there are folks who have children that should never be allowed to have children. Maybe the answer is everyone should have some required birthcontrol; male and female; and have to have a license to go off of it--after all we have to prove our fitness to drive a car!

[Anjiru]

I think my mom said it best when I asked her about her thoughts on the topic: I don't believe a woman should abort for the shake to abort but for a reason like if the woman was raped, life/ death matters, or something is wrong with the baby.

Those would be the only reasons that I believe a woman should abort because each reason most likely will have a negative outcome.

It is hard and a terrible thing to tell a child who was born not of the mother's choice about why he came to be. Think of the thoughts running though the kid's head that he was forced upon his mother because of a forceful act or the mother's thoughts when she looks at him. A sitaution that would arise in the child being killed or the mother before birth. If the woman can't carry the child to term then the abortion should be an option because the emotional stress of taking a chace that the baby will feel pain during this time is hard for the parents. No one wants to have thier child suffer in unbearable pain, at least anyone who loves the child.

These are my veiws so please don't bash them to death.

[eternalsnow08]

i think that abortion should be banned. even thought it is in the mothers' womb, it is still a growing human child that is being murdered and the mothers don't get in trouble for murdering their child cause it is in the womb. if the mother doesn't want the child, let the child be born and let it be adopted but there are some that don't even think of that option and that isn't right. also, if you don't want a child in the first place, don't do it!! plan and simple idea that women could follow in order for this not to happen.

[Enjoying Ur Death]

oh come off it. women want to do it just as much as men so how can they follow a rule such as that. as for banning it and putting it up for adoption, is not sumthing that will help either. there are already so many children in this world who don't have parents and get fed up with moving from home to home. hardly any1 wants to adopt sum1 else's kid and the only ones that do are ones who can't have any of their own which is very few. i say abortion is ok under sum surcomstances such as a rape or other things like that. plus even if u use condoms and take pills and such there is still a chance to get pregnant when ur not intending to. i mean condoms can break and cause an unplanned prenancy that leads to abortion and the pill u women take is only 99% affective which leaves that 1% a way to get pregnant. now i'm not trying to be rude but u ppl need to open up ur eyes and look around u before u start saying that we need to ban abortion for this world is already getting cramped as land is being torn down and scarce because we have to keep making homes for families.

[Drunkenvalley]

Sheesh, eternalsnow08. Whose live is being murdered, I must ask? Those that usually take an abortion are people who want to live life and not be a baby factory.

Not to mention.. If we didn't have abortion we'd get overpopulation of the planet pretty quickly, you know. I mean, a child here, a child there..

[Enjoying Ur Death]

what drunkenvalley said. if we were to ban abortion and just continue to have children this world would get overpopulated and we'd have no where else to go. it's not like we can turn the ocean into land we can live on cuz then what would happen to all the water? and banning abortion would only lead to what is happening in japan. they keep having kids so now they have a law that states u must have only 1 child per family cuz if u have more than that then u have to pay the government more money. and what do u think happens to all the children that just get tossed away? they either die,are treated badly in orphanges,or they end up corrupt. just face it a world without abortion is just asking to be destroyed by our own foolishness.

[movie_chick7]

Personally I think abortion is wrong. But woman have the right to think for herself. She can decide whether she wants to have the baby or.....kill it.

I also agree with your statement. I don't be live in abortion but a girl should have a right to decide if she want it or not.

[Drunkenvalley]

That's China, Enjoying Ur Death, not Japan.

And the idea isn't that you can't have more than 1 kid, but that the government only supports a single child per family. At least, that was how it worked last time I read about it.

[Enjoying Ur Death]

meh well i'm just trying to over exagerate so these children that believe that abortion should be banned can open up their damn eyes and look around to see what is around them and ponder how this world would be if we just kept having children nonstop 24/7 cuz a child is born sumwhere around the country everyday all day. so just open up ur small little brains that god gave you and think about life now with abortion and life without it.

[Evan On Rye]

I think it's pretty ridiculous when people get pregnant and do it because they're not prepared for it, but I'm for it if the woman has been raped. I still don't really think of it as murder if it's early enough. I mean because then you're pretty much just killing a fetus. It would be like crying over a chicken egg that I ate that had just been fertilized. I mean, I'm still eating the beginnings of life, but it's not like it's aware by then. However screwed up that sounds, it's my opinion.

[eternalsnow08]

Sheesh, eternalsnow08. Whose live is being murdered, I must ask? Those that usually take an abortion are people who want to live life and not be a baby factory.

Not to mention.. If we didn't have abortion we'd get overpopulation of the planet pretty quickly, you know. I mean, a child here, a child there..

well, it has been proven that the baby inside the woman is alive and like a human child so in a way, if you have an abortion, you are killing someone.

[Drunkenvalley]

Back from a shower, there was one thing that struck me..

A lot of people seem to forget a core question related to abortion. Namely why people take abortions.

So, I am going to compose a quick list:
Social standing
Now imagine that you're a high-standing, female politician for instance. A woman that maybe enjoys sex, but has a career they don't want to ditch because of a screeching, small infant that takes up ALL of their time and most likely gives them a bad reputation, smacking them far down the reputation ladders.
Age
[i]You know, it'd be just wrong if children below the age of 16, or women below the age of 20, have children.
Bodytype
Some people may have personal health issues that may make it ridiculously hard to give birth by normal means, or who do not have the body to take care of the child afterwards.
Circumstances surrounding the conception of the child
Isn't it just wrong to force women to have a child, if they were for example raped? So not only do you ruin their social life, most likely, their social standing, their reputation, and their mentality, but now you force a child onto them as well?
Handicapped children
Sometimes, the child may have things like downs-syndrome. Now don't go yell at me for saying this, but taking care of such a child can be very, very stressful, and may even really, really ruin other people's lives in the process.
Education
You may be in the middle of education for a very promising career and a healthy life. Y' know how this story goes, as it's basically #1.
Pick of partner
Basically the one about circumstances.. but if you end up with a child and you really, really regret even having met the father, it's usually a bad idea to have a child in the first place with that man.
Enjoying sex
Well, you might just have a very healthy sex-life with your partner, but not wanting a kid. Or not having the opportunity to have one. Mix it with any of the above, basically.


And eternalsnow08... the actual time where you consider an infant a sentient human varies from scientist to scientist far as I know. And AGAIN... Do you not give a damned about mothers in general? Have you taken into consideration that there are REASONS to take abortion?

[Enjoying Ur Death]

eternalsnow08 must hate their mother if they don't consider how painful it is to give birth to a human-being that is like 9 to 10 pounds and 22 to 23 inches long, but hey who are we to argue against enternalsnow08? oh that's right.....we're the ppl who actually care for the mothers and decisions to abort a pregnancy. for crying out loud if a woman wants to abort then let them and don't bug them about it. it was their decision for their own body,health, and mentality.

[Drunkenvalley]

Enjoying Ur Death, let's keep it civil, shall we? :)

[Enjoying Ur Death]

yeah yeah yeah i know. just got a bit mad there is all. but it's true at times. a person that wishes to ban abortion is probably sum1 that doesn't appreciate their mother. abortion is really not bad at all contrary to what sum ppl believe.

[Drunkenvalley]

That last sentence was oddly formulated though, considering your earlier opinions here. ^^;

[eternalsnow08]

yes, i do. but it is still wrong for women to have abortions. in my opinion, maybe if there was a guideline to where best to have an abortion. even though i hate them and never do it myself cause i am a girl, if, like it was said earlier, that it was a rape that had caused, i could see that being fine. other than that, i don't think that in alright at all.

[Enjoying Ur Death]

eternalsnow08. a question for u. if u were to get pregnant at a time in ur life where everything was going right for u.......let's say like u were doing a job u love so much, and never planned on getting married.......would you abort in order to keep ur job and ur good life or give it all up to live a miserable life with a child u never really wanted?

that right there is just one of the questions that goes thru the minds of women that get preganat by accident. they abort because it wasn't sumthing they had planned for themselves at the moment at least.

[eternalsnow08]

i would keep the child and my job. i have my family and many friends at my church that would help. i would never abandon my child even if it was born by accident. i would still love the child like every child should be.

[MangaAddict]

i would keep the child and my job. i have my family and many friends at my church that would help. i would never abandon my child even if it was born by accident. i would still love the child like every child should be.

But not everyone has that sort of support. There are many women out there who have no one to turn to for help.
How do you feel about women who were raped and got pregnant? Shouldn't they at least be able to abort? They shouldn't have to carry a child who they most likely hold contempt for.

[Enjoying Ur Death]

There's also the fact that some women cut ties with their families for reasons or their families just dump them and forget about them. that and the fact that not all of us go to church (sorry jesus even though i'm cathloic i can't believe in sumthing that only has the word of a damn book to prove ur exsistence). anyway, not all women can keep their child and not all women have the mentality of wanting to keep a child they had no plan of ever having. ur only saying that you would keep the child because u have the support of other people,but when ur alone,with no money,no family, and no heart or mentality to keep the child, women should be allowed to abort.

[Evan On Rye]

Exactly how I think about it. I mean, do people believe someone should have a child when they we're forced to? I mean, you can look at it like it's totally wrong in every way, but I think it's all based on a persons circumstance.

[ghassassin]

Thanks to abortion we are only 6 billion. If your mom had aborted you, we would have been 1 less. Isn't that great?

Pregnancy occurs at times, despite the birth control measures. Who gives a damn about some "thing" in your stomach which doesn't even have a physical existence in humanity?

Now for the facts, abortion is a taboo in Islam. An average Islamic couple has 6-8 children. And that includes those educated ones who settle at 1 and 2. Go the Islamic rural areas. Women are machines there. Its like you order a child and in 9 months....there. Seems like they can give infinite births. At times (these are facts), they even forget the faces if their kids due to the numbers. 15 kids in a goddamn family, how the hell will they get enough attention?

[RhyssaFireheart]

yes, i do. but it is still wrong for women to have abortions. in my opinion, maybe if there was a guideline to where best to have an abortion. even though i hate them and never do it myself cause i am a girl, if, like it was said earlier, that it was a rape that had caused, i could see that being fine. other than that, i don't think that in alright at all.

Until you have been put into a situation where you have to choose whether or not to have a child, then everything is speculation. If something happened and you had to decide to continue a pregnancy or terminate it, your views might change when it's your own body to be considered.

Personally, at my age now, if I were to get pregnant somehow, I would have an abortion. I have no desire for children, I have no children and I don't want to ruin my life as it is now with children. However, my life experience is much different than probably most of the people posting in this thread, so I can't apply my experiences to anyone else. And in return, I wouldn't want anyone to impose their experiences (or lack thereof) upon me either.

For example, my niece recently made a bad decision on her part and became sexually active at far too young an age. I went to the hospital with her and her father and my mom (he's a single parent technically) and we had her tested and got the morning after pill. If something had happened and she became pregnant, she would have gotten an abortion because like I said, she's far too young to be ruining her life with a baby now. She shouldn't have to be saddled with that kind of pressure and stigma for years, even to carry a baby to term and give it up for adoption, just because someone else thinks it's a sin. Even my mom agreed with that decision, and she's still very religious.

Abortion is a very circumstantial situation, and until you've been faced with making that decision, you can't know what it's like. However, despite what I or anyone else thinks, it needs to remain legal so that women have the right to make their own decisions and not have them made for them.

[Enjoying Ur Death]

go rhyssa!!!! couldn't say it any better. just plain and simple abortion needs to continue being legal because it's a woman's body and they should to it what the heck they want to. if they want an abortion well you go ahead snd get one plain and simple.

[videocruiser]

That's just horrible the way you said you don't wanna ruin your life right now by having a child. Hey thats fine if you don't want to have one, but it's just stupid saying that it would ruin your life. If so have your tubes tied or just don't have sex, that way you wont risk "ruining your life".

I don't believe in abortions (except in a case were it was rape) if they didn't want a child shouldn't have had sex in the first play. Sex is for reproducing first, then pleasure or whatever you want to say it is.

I know its the woman who carry the baby, feed and all in the early stage, but what the man doesn't have any say, zilch, the woman can just up go kill their kid (yes i classify it as murder) . Other options, adoption or once the kid is off of or never was on breastfeeding pass the child into the (boyfriend/husband/whoever got you pregnant) care.

[loop]

i dont think its right to have an abortion. there is another being living inside of you. i dont think she should have the right to kill someone else just because she doesnt want to give birth to a child. but i can also see that its hard and stressful to be to carrying a baby around when your not ready. but it was mainly thier mistake. don't have sex without protection or just dont do it at all. well theres the rape cases but i dont want to talk about that.

[Chrno]

i don't think its right but, i agree with the woman to let her do it. I mean its her chose not ours. If she wants to get rid of the child then let her. But she should take the responsiblity of the child for having sex unprotected, but ya i think its wrong.

[shonenshojo]

It would be worst if the child was raised in a bad environment. If you can't support the child in the first place it's better to abort. If you don't and he can't grow up properly then it would be as bad as torturing the child. So I don't really mind if someone aborts. Well, unless the person is perfectly capable of taking care of the kid and they just want to abort because they don't like the dad. In which case the woman should take the responsibility for having sex unprotected.

[Enjoying Ur Death]

all of u believe that it is wrong but look at the picture here. you have sex for pleasure and statisfaction. whether u use condoms or not is ur decision. for women u should be on the pill anyway so don't ever forget to take it. as for abortion, do it only if it is the right thing for u to do. most of u need to open ur eyes and see how over populated this world is and killing off babies that aren't even able to talk, walk, or even think, is one way of keeping our world safe from distructiuon of land developement. and i know i'm sounding heartless but u can't consider something human if they are unable to think or learn.

[Drunkenvalley]

"Sex is for reproduction"?
Sex was made to be enjoyed. Except that it can get quite uncomfortably position-wise, and that it may make for some awkward privacy depending on which bed you pick. (Don't pick the squeaky one.)

I get the picture that people still got a "Sex = Reproduction", which I find quite honestly ridiculous. How about this: We stuff a baby up yours, and ask if you'd like it. How's that? Don't want it?

Well, I'm quite sure there are quite a few women thinking this when, despite whatever they did to avoid it, they end up with being preggers.

And sorry, loop, but I'm going to be frank: There are tons of times when people do mistakes which they don't want to happen, neither now nor ever again.

There is a multitude of people that think like you, think like me, think otherwise, think similar but not quite the same. Most of these people are probably going to be asking themselves when they find out they got a kid: Do I want this?

PS: Forcing a woman to have a child, even if it was her own mistake that she got pregnant, is what I'd classify as rape.

EDIT:
I just thought I'd mention this, but I'll put it to you smartasses saying sex is for reproduction: Sex. Is. Fun.

If done right.

[videocruiser]

sex is for #1 is reproduction then after that it's whatever you want to think, explain to me then how reproduction works minus science, Equals sex or penetration one way or another .

Its not rape to "force a woman to have a baby" rape is sex without permission, a mistake is a mistake.

Also if it was possible to take the baby from my partner and put into to me (may sound weird to people but like i care) I would, like i would let her kill my child, like i would care about the pain or side effects its my kid.. (I say mine cause if she wanted a abortion then obviously she wouldn't say it's hers)

And for the second and last time to avoid "mistakes" avoid sex or get tubes tied (even though there not 100% reliable)

[Enjoying Ur Death]

first off, in order to reproduce a person must want to have sex for the pleasure, so u have sex for pleasure first then to reproduce. second, how can sum1 avoid sex? u want to have sex so u do. and y do we want to have sex? cuz we want to feel pleasure. the first thing that crosses a persons mind when it comes to sex is pleasure not "Oh i want to have a kid." Next is that with hormones and such, a teeanger can't avoid sex unless sum1 doesn't like them and no1 wants to give it up. plus, what teenager would want to get their tubes tied? u must be crazy! getting ur tubes tied when ur like 30 sumthing and don't want kids is cool or like during ur 20s is ok cuz by then u know u don't want kids but come on really think. plus u just said it's not 100% reliable so in the end the woman may or may not still have an abortion.

[Drunkenvalley]

sex is for #1 is reproduction then after that it's whatever you want to think, explain to me then how reproduction works minus science, Equals sex or penetration one way or another .

Its not rape to "force a woman to have a baby" rape is sex without permission, a mistake is a mistake.

Also if it was possible to take the baby from my partner and put into to me (may sound weird to people but like i care) I would, like i would let her kill my child, like i would care about the pain or side effects its my kid.. (I say mine cause if she wanted a abortion then obviously she wouldn't say it's hers)

And for the second and last time to avoid "mistakes" avoid sex or get tubes tied (even though there not 100% reliable)

The actual, simplest definition is "to violate".

I do indeed go as far as to call being forced to have a baby something as big as rape. You want to violate women's lives by not giving them even the opportunity to say "No, I don't want this"?

Finally, sir, I must explain a simple, small thing:
Humans enjoy sex. Women too are part of the human race, by the way, if you didn't know. Now, there's a difference between wanting a child, and wanting a child at the time, but once you got your tubes tied I'm quite under the impression there's no way back.

Oh, and my personally favorite quote ever:
78% of those against abortions are men. 100% of those will never be pregnant.

Know why I support abortion?

It helps to keep control of the population.
It prevents flooding the orphanages.
Women who get pregnant despite their best attempts to avoid it have the choice to say "No, I don't want it" -- aka the freedom to say no is still there.
While some women are for abortion, and some are against, the right to have it should be available if only to let them have the freedom to live their lives as they want it.
Having a child can be more of a burden, particularly if you don't want the child (which is why you take an abortion to begin with)..

[RhyssaFireheart]

That's just horrible the way you said you don't wanna ruin your life right now by having a child. Hey thats fine if you don't want to have one, but it's just stupid saying that it would ruin your life. If so have your tubes tied or just don't have sex, that way you wont risk "ruining your life".
Okay, I'll take this piece by piece.

How old are you, videocruiser? Yes, this is relevant to the discussion because you are countering my comments. You ignored the part where I said that my life experiences were probably much different than most of you posting in this thread. I've been married for longer than most of the people on the board have been alive, so saying "don't have sex then" doesn't really apply to me.

As for having my tubes tied, you don't know if I have or haven't had that procedure done. It's not 100% effective. Oh, and why is that final option always on the woman, btw? Why can't a man have a vasectomy instead? For the record, not that it matters, but I can't have children. One deformed tube + one tubal pregancy (scarring) = no kiddies for Rhyssa, thank the forty little gods. That still does not rule out something happening and me getting pregnant somehow. Only menopause is the final determiner there.

As for ruining my life - yes, it would ruin my life as it is now to have a child. Not only am I past what should be the "safe" age for having children, but I personally don't want to disrupt anything to raise a child and be in my 60s by the time it's out of the house on it's own. And you know what? That's fine with me. You should also reread the reasons that Drunkenvalley has put in his posts.


I don't believe in abortions (except in a case were it was rape) if they didn't want a child shouldn't have had sex in the first play. Sex is for reproducing first, then pleasure or whatever you want to say it is.

I know its the woman who carry the baby, feed and all in the early stage, but what the man doesn't have any say, zilch, the woman can just up go kill their kid (yes i classify it as murder) . Other options, adoption or once the kid is off of or never was on breastfeeding pass the child into the (boyfriend/husband/whoever got you pregnant) care.
Going by this part of your post, you're young, probably teens is my guess. If I'm right, then you have no life experience to go on. Sex is a natural part of the human existence. Yes, it results in procreation, that's the bonus. But that is not the only purpose for sex. If procreation were the only need for sex, then woman would only be fertile for one maybe two times per year, similar to most mammals instead of being fertile year round (approximately 12-13 times per year, based on the lunar calendar) for a relatively normal, healthy human woman.

As for handing off the baby to the male of the relationship, yeah, good luck with that. Have you even bothered to look up the default rate for unpaid child support by men? Women can and are arrested for abandoning their children when they can't afford to support them (partly because they've done it wrong, but still) but men aren't chased down like that. The government doesn't put that much effort into taking care of backdue support because there is so much of it many times.

It's a responsibility issue. People taking responsibility for their actions in all things, not just what's convenient for them. So don't sit there and by implication put all the burden of support on the woman when men are just as guilty. It takes two to tango.

Once again, whether or not someone may personally agree with abortion, the option itself needs to remain legal and available. Just because you can't imagine ever needing to use a service, doesn't mean others won't need it. And that applies to anything, not just abortion. You start limiting any rights "because it's bad" or "because it's a sin" and that starts a slippery slope (yeah, I'm going there) where rights get chipped away because someone doesn't agree with them.

[ghassassin]

Actually, after reading some posts here, I feel like having someone carry my sperms and rub the dead fetus in their faces. If abortion is murder, then heck, even non-vegetarians are murderer. Did you ever felt this before ordering Pan-fried Pork? And don't give me bs that you are a vegetarian.

I will get my girl pregnant as many times I want (till it is medically healthy of course) and kill the fetus each time. Who the bloody hell are you to question me? I don't want a child, neither now in my teens, nor in the future. And what if ..somehow...it happens? I won't be carrying something, which I never wanted, for the rest of my life.

Sex is for reproduction? Huh? What era are you from, 2000 B.C.? Had that been the case, I would have procreated a whole city by now.

[miavizard]

after reading some post here..
man..its ridiculous if people said that sex is for reproduction..what did they think they are??chicken??ugh..gross..but ghasassin..isnt that cruel making ur gf pregnant as many time u want??at least use some protection dude..my fren told me,its kinda hurt during the process..

frankly speaking,abortion is people rights..theres no need to force them to do wat they dun want to,.its for fun..admit it!!n if u too scare for getting pregnant and hesitate to using any protection ..just avoid sex [just weirdo would do that tho]but seriously...sex isnt for reproduction..ugh..

[Drunkenvalley]

Well, I thought I'd might as well quote myself from earlier, as it's quite a few pages back.

Back from a shower, there was one thing that struck me..

A lot of people seem to forget a core question related to abortion. Namely why people take abortions.

So, I am going to compose a quick list:
Social standing
Now imagine that you're a high-standing, female politician for instance. A woman that maybe enjoys sex, but has a career they don't want to ditch because of a screeching, small infant that takes up ALL of their time and most likely gives them a bad reputation, smacking them far down the reputation ladders.
Age
[i]You know, it'd be just wrong if children below the age of 16, or women below the age of 20, have children.
Bodytype
Some people may have personal health issues that may make it ridiculously hard to give birth by normal means, or who do not have the body to take care of the child afterwards.
Circumstances surrounding the conception of the child
Isn't it just wrong to force women to have a child, if they were for example raped? So not only do you ruin their social life, most likely, their social standing, their reputation, and their mentality, but now you force a child onto them as well?
Handicapped children
Sometimes, the child may have things like downs-syndrome. Now don't go yell at me for saying this, but taking care of such a child can be very, very stressful, and may even really, really ruin other people's lives in the process.
Education
You may be in the middle of education for a very promising career and a healthy life. Y' know how this story goes, as it's basically #1.
Pick of partner
Basically the one about circumstances.. but if you end up with a child and you really, really regret even having met the father, it's usually a bad idea to have a child in the first place with that man.
Enjoying sex
Well, you might just have a very healthy sex-life with your partner, but not wanting a kid. Or not having the opportunity to have one. Mix it with any of the above, basically.

[OmniCloud]

Sex is not only for reproduction sure, but it's also a responsibility issue as Ryhssa brought out. Let me share something with you. My wife and I married very young. Before we got serious, I "kept her around" so to speak, because I was young, stupid, and immature. Not realizing what a beautiful person she was, and of course not realizing I could spend the rest of my life with her.

In short, we weren't that close at first, but we did have sex? What was the outcome, she had an abortion without telling me. She didn't want me to be "stuck" with her. She did it, regretted the hell out of it, and I didn't even notice anything happened.

So what's the morale of the story? I was insanely pissed off when I found out!! At myself, at her, and everything! My son, could be 3-4 years old right now, my daughter could be saying her first words! Yes, it is a heart-breaking thing to do, it is most certainly murder, but it is still up to each and every individual if they want to make that decision.

My advice, speaking from experience is use the tools available today to not start a family when your not ready. And if you mess up, just go for it. With Jehovah in your life, you'll be able to get through even the most difficult of situations. If you take the easy way out, you'll realize it's not easy at all. Your conscious will bother you, and you'll alway think about the "what if".

Responsibility...

[Drunkenvalley]

"And if you mess up, just go for it" isn't that simple, cleverboy. I refer to my list of reasons in the post above yours.

A better advice is something along the lines of this:
My advice is to go with it if you easily get very conscious and very deeply regret things that are currently a morale question, or if you feel that you are actually ready for it at all.

[ghassassin]

Well that would be debatable. If mother wants the child but father doesn't, or vice versa, whose decision is to hold good? If a mother can do it on her own, go for it. If she can't, she doesn't have the right to force the father. If its the other way round, things are different. Women have the upper hand there. What really can the man do?

Who the hell is Jehovah, btw?

[SunnySky]

Even though this is a debate, I think gotten into a very heated discussion right now. I personally am not for nor am I against one or the other. I’m my personal experience I have had a abortion when I was 15, I’m now 17. Regret is something you live with after. The mistake was mine I will take full responsibility but weather I had a choice in the abortion or not is a different question, parents are very pushy when it comes to a child especially since I was 15 back then. In saying this I do understand why people make the personal choice of abortion.

[OmniCloud]

Well that would be debatable. If mother wants the child but father doesn't, or vice versa, whose decision is to hold good? If a mother can do it on her own, go for it. If she can't, she doesn't have the right to force the father. If its the other way round, things are different. Women have the upper hand there. What really can the man do?

Who the hell is Jehovah, btw?Yahweh or Jehovah is God's name translated from it's original Hebrew text. A little respect buddy;)

btw--I understand that there are different situations for different people. My "go for it" comment wasn't trying to take having a kid lightly at all. But out of respect for life, you simply go for it, deal with the struggle, and hope for the best, and I believe you will find the strength needed to survive and be happy.

This is my stand on it anyway...

[Enjoying Ur Death]

most people out there that get pregnant just aren't people that should be trusted to raise a kid. i mean look at all the criminals out there? they got that way from bad parenting and y cuz the parents thought they could raise since hey it's a "human being and it's wrong to kill it." abortion is not bad and should be kept legal cuz it'll limit the number of people going out and killing others. also, no matter what a person always lives with an "what if?" what if i did this? what if i did that? what if this happened instead? there's always gonna be a what if and as suppose to the what if's after abortions, well it's just another what if u got to live with for if u look at ur surroundings and i mean really look, u'd see that at that time u weren't ready to raise the child. u had no foundation to have a child grow up in front of ur eyes.

[Drunkenvalley]

Yahweh or Jehovah is God's name translated from it's original Hebrew text. A little respect buddy;)

btw--I understand that there are different situations for different people. My "go for it" comment wasn't trying to take having a kid lightly at all. But out of respect for life, you simply go for it, deal with the struggle, and hope for the best, and I believe you will find the strength needed to survive and be happy.

This is my stand on it anyway...

If I was to summarize you in three words it would be:
You're a guy.

Well, technically that would be four words "You are a guy". But whatever.

Abortion isn't a recommended option, but it is an option. And should always remain one.

Also, why the feck are you even mentioning gods? Not even remotely related to the current subject beyond where the morals against abortion or prevention came to life.

...And respect for your religion? Hah. You might as well lay down on the road and ask me to drive over it with a car.

That's about as much respect for your religion you're getting from me.

[ghassassin]

Yahweh or Jehovah is God's name translated from it's original Hebrew text. A little respect buddy;)

btw--I understand that there are different situations for different people. My "go for it" comment wasn't trying to take having a kid lightly at all. But out of respect for life, you simply go for it, deal with the struggle, and hope for the best, and I believe you will find the strength needed to survive and be happy.

This is my stand on it anyway...

What does God have to do with abortion? Whatever the hell that Jehovah is, better keep him out of my life.

Respect for life? What respect will I have for life if it gives me unwanted things? And a child only has an existence when it crawls out of the womb. Otherwise it is only a worthless thing lying in the uterus. It is not a person under the Constitution, and that a right to privacy exists. The unborn have never been recognized...as persons in the whole sense and thus fetuses are not legally entitled to the protection afforded by the right to life.

[OmniCloud]

lol...your responses speak for you...

Ridicule me for throwing God in a statement, yet you guys reason with yourself, and other people for views on life? ("oh, well the constitution says, a fetus doesn't have rights yet" ridiculous and ignorant on so many different levels)

Did I ever say abortion should be illegal? Regardless, I'm done with this thread, it's obvious people don't care about morals anymore?

You don't even know what my religion is, and from your post Drunkenvalley, it's obvious you don't believe in anything but yourself and your own understanding of life. If being disrespectful makes you feel better, then go ahead, I'm just stating my opinion on the subject buddy. "you are a guy? Well my wife isn't, and she regrets getting an abortion even more than I do! So what's your advice to her--"you are a girl". Your stating an opinion just like everyone else here, and your advice is lackluster to say the least. I never said people shouldn't have the option to have an abortion. I said it's a responsibility issue and a choice for people to make. I said, my personal experience leads me to believe taking the "easy" way out is just as bad as keeping the child when your not ready for it. So tell me, what the hell was your comment even supposed to criticize me on besides showing your failure to comprehend a legible post?

@Ghassassin--I take it you must be an atheist? If you are then disregard this post?

If your aren't then do you understand when I said God's Name? "God bless America" "In God we trust" That God! Jehovah isn't some special God that only my religion worships?!? It's simply God's name, which is more personal. God is a title, just like King or Prince. Jehovah, or Yaweh (depending on what pronunciation you think is more accurate) is his personal name.

I just want you to know what your saying when you make comments like "Whatever the hell Jehovah is"

btw-When did I ever say God belongs in this thread? I was simply talking about going through the struggle of having a kid early, and relying on someone for strength? For me, that person is God. Why are people bashing like I'm pointing fingers calling people evil or something?

I can't wait till a mod read these ignorant post.

[RhyssaFireheart]

People, stop with the bashing. OmniCloud wasn't advocating religion as part of the debate at all. It was part of his experience, but it's not part of the debate. Nor did he seem to say people needed to have (a) god in their lives in order to make a decision about abortion.

Another thing, show respect for another person's religious beliefs even if you don't share them. That is common courtesy and extends to all discussions, not just this one. If you want someone to listen to your ideas with respect, then do the same in return. Ghass and Drunkenvalley, I'd say you both owe Omni an apology for your comments. I'm not a believer anymore myself, but I would never spit on someone else's beliefs like that. I was taught better and both of you should be mature enough as well to know that also.

As I've said many times on the NBOP forums - debate the topic, not the person. If you can't avoid debating the person, then take it to PMs or just don't reply. The comments about Jehovah were an indirect bash against Omni and weren't related to the topic at hand. If you want to debate about God's existence or the lack thereof, then take it to that thread.

[OmniCloud]

Thank you Rhyssa, but you may have to flame me in the next thread above...I lost my cool....

[Drunkenvalley]

Rhyssa, I don't mind respecting people. :) But I seem to have misinterpreted/misunderstood here. For that much I'm sorry. ^^;

Nonetheless, I'm off from this thread, as there's not really much new here by now that hasn't been mentioned about three times as is. And.. what started this page shouldn't be continued, at least not in this thread.

(PS: Though to answer real quick, I do not believe in any god whatsoever. Life is there to live, and attempt not to mess up. That's all there is to it for me. :) )

[boogle bear]

Im not sure if anyone has already said this cause i didnt fell like reading everything buuuuuuuut


Say a teenage girl is raped by anyone in particular, whoever would stoop down that low, now say that she gets pregnant from the rape your saying that she has to have that child can you imagine the emotional stress a teenage girl could get from something like that if its out of thier hands its out of thier hands. I think everyone should have enough responsibility to use protection when doing the deed ; ) but in the case that something unplanned like rape happens they should be the person who makes the final decision no one else you can't TELL someone to have a child or not to.

[washkid]

Let me ask you all a question.

Do any of you believe in an absolute standard for what is right?

I am well aware that everyone has a different oppinion in different matters. But, would any of you say that there is only one real truth when it comes to what is right and what is wrong? Or, can truth only be defined depending on a persons view.

[Drunkenvalley]

It is because of the many opinions and the variations of people that we need to keep abortion legal at least. :P

[writer-in-training]

I don't think you guys are understanding everything here. Abortion not only hurts the baby (by the way I hate the idea of killing any child even if the mother was raped, look around you there are tons of people whose mother was raped and they are perfectly fine (and speaking against abortion)) but it hurts the mother too. I can't tell you how many teenagers have died because of an abortion or are permanently traumitized because of it. ABortion is very very dangerous. Not to mention the fact that the babies actually feel the pain. That is an actual fact. And I know some of you guys might not want to hear it but face the facts abortion is murder.

[MangaAddict]

I don't think you guys are understanding everything here. Abortion not only hurts the baby (by the way I hate the idea of killing any child even if the mother was raped, look around you there are tons of people whose mother was raped and they are perfectly fine (and speaking against abortion)) but it hurts the mother too. I can't tell you how many teenagers have died because of an abortion or are permanently traumitized because of it. ABortion is very very dangerous. Not to mention the fact that the babies actually feel the pain. That is an actual fact. And I know some of you guys might not want to hear it but face the facts abortion is murder.

Going by your viewpoint, any person who is in need of any operation is in danger because there is a possibility of death and therefore they should not do it. The fact that abortion is risky is not a good enough reason to outlaw it or all operations would be outlawed.
And even though some raped mothers are okay with their children, that doesn't mean ALL of them are. There are many, many cases where raped victims are a psychological mess and it's completely unfair to make them bare children that were forced upon them.

[Megabuster]

I dont believe in abortions. Killing is illegal, an abortion is killing so it should be illegal.
I understand that some people get raped, or are teenagers and whatnot but just give birth and give the baby to an orphanage. Just because you dont want a baby doesnt mean you should kill it. Most people who get abortions arent rape victims, they are stupid teens who want to have sex but dont use any protection.

[MangaAddict]

I dont believe in abortions. Killing is illegal, an abortion is killing so it should be illegal.
I understand that some people get raped, or are teenagers and whatnot but just give birth and give the baby to an orphanage. Just because you dont want a baby doesnt mean you should kill it. Most people who get abortions arent rape victims, they are stupid teens who want to have sex but dont use any protection.

People make mistakes. Even people who use protection can get pregnant. Just because they made a mistake doesn't mean they should have to deal with the mental stress of having a child.
My opinion is, if it is able to be born and can live on its own, then you should not be allowed to get an abortion. Anytime before that should be legal.
Personally, I could never get an abortion because I would feel so completely regretful. But that doesn't mean I would force my opinion on others. I think women should have the right to get an abortion if a child could totally disrupt their lives.

[Megabuster]

People make mistakes. Even people who use protection can get pregnant. Just because they made a mistake doesn't mean they should have to deal with the mental stress of having a child.
My opinion is, if it is able to be born and can live on its own, then you should not be allowed to get an abortion. Anytime before that should be legal.
Personally, I could never get an abortion because I would feel so completely regretful. But that doesn't mean I would force my opinion on others. I think women should have the right to get an abortion if a child could totally disrupt their lives.

But your stopping life, the second that thing becomes even a blastocyst its alive. Its capable of living as long as you don't kill it. Just because you use protection doesn't give you the right to kill an unborn baby. Deal with the consequences of your actions. When you choose to have sex, there is a chance that a baby will be born. That is the whole purpose of sex anyway.

[Drunkenvalley]

Megabuster.. Take a simple, simple look at what having children does to the women..

Have you taken three seconds to consider the fact that as much as you save a baby's life you've possibly killed the mother's...?

[AYAME]

I have always been black and white on this subject. Abortion is wrong for any reason. It's murder. It is a human being from the moment of conception, not just a technical term of "fetus". However, I have held three of my babies in my arms, watched them gasping for air, watched their pink skin turn to a grayish blue, and then nothing. Three funerals, three grave sites. Three times, because I did not agree with abortion, until after the first time, then it was because my husband did not agree with abortion. When I became pregnant the last time, if the amnio had proved the same fate as the others, I would have aborted. Would I have been wrong to make that decision? Now, I say no. I still believe a fetus is a human being, a zygote is a human being. I believe lines should be drawn as to what is acceptable for an abortion to be performed. The problem is, who decides what those lines are? For me, it is no longer black and white, every situation is different. One person can not decide for the entire population. It has to be an individual choice, based on the individuals beliefs, and the individuals situation. I can only do what my conscious will allow, but I can not force that belief on others.

[Megabuster]

Megabuster.. Take a simple, simple look at what having children does to the women..

Have you taken three seconds to consider the fact that as much as you save a baby's life you've possibly killed the mother's...?

So because of the chance of death during child birth you should just kill the baby? There is a chance of death in almost anything, some higher than others. If you are having sex, you should be prepared for the consequences.

Unless the child itself is completely screwed up, or is going to die anyway, i dont see any reason for an abortion.

[Drunkenvalley]

I'll put in a basic point in regards to everyone calling abortion murder:

Those who take abortion do it to live their own life.

It is as simple as that. In other words, it doesn't help no matter what you say about children being murdered.. If you force a baby onto a woman who doesn't want it you've killed her...

[Megabuster]

I'll put in a basic point in regards to everyone calling abortion murder:

Those who take abortion do it to live their own life.

It is as simple as that. In other words, it doesn't help no matter what you say about children being murdered.. If you force a baby onto a woman who doesn't want it you've killed her...

No, thats completely stupid.

Are you literally referring to death or do you mean emotionally and all that other crap.
When you have sex, there is always a chance of giving birth to a child. You took the risk and now you have to pay the pied piper.

[Enjoying Ur Death]

ok megabuster go have sex, make a baby, and then give ur life up. sound good?

Now doing sumthing like that might sound ok to most of u but come on really. u never know what u're going to do till ur actualy put into that situation. right now u say u would give up ur life,dreams, and every chance to have an actual career just so u could end up with a dead end job and a child and wife/husband at home. abortion is just a choice that mothers have. if they want to get rid of the child then thy should be allowed to for it is their body not urs. killing the baby might seem bad in words but in the minds and thoughts of ppl who actually go through it and are faced with the choice of keeping the child or not is when abortion needs to stay a choice.

[Megabuster]

ok megabuster go have sex, make a baby, and then give ur life up. sound good?

Now doing sumthing like that might sound ok to most of u but come on really. u never know what u're going to do till ur actualy put into that situation. right now u say u would give up ur life,dreams, and every chance to have an actual career just so u could end up with a dead end job and a child and wife/husband at home. abortion is just a choice that mothers have. if they want to get rid of the child then thy should be allowed to for it is their body not urs. killing the baby might seem bad in words but in the minds and thoughts of ppl who actually go through it and are faced with the choice of keeping the child or not is when abortion needs to stay a choice.

If you dont want to have to make that decision then dont have sex. What dont you understand about this? Is it that sex is so desirable that facing the consequences for something so good must be wrong. You are killing something,a human being, because you couldnt keep your pants on. Why should you be allowed to kill your baby? what gives you the right to take a life because you were careless with yours?

[tears123]

If you dont want to have to make that decision then dont have sex. What dont you understand about this? Is it that sex is so desirable that facing the consequences for something so good must be wrong. You are killing something,a human being, because you couldnt keep your pants on. Why should you be allowed to kill your baby? what gives you the right to take a life because you were careless with yours?

What if your drunk? The reason most of this pregnancy happens?

[Megabuster]

What if your drunk? The reason most of this pregnancy happens?

Thats your reason for killing a baby? Because you got drunk and had sex? Where are you getting drunk that you're immediately getting knocked up by something. You shouldnt be getting drunk alone in a bar or where ever. If thats your answer i think you need to re-evaluate your life.

[tears123]

Oh my god. I was asking just innocently, I didn't have anything against you, but you're being so mean. T_T

You don't realize the responsibilities of having a baby. The financial issues, and everything else around that.

[methaniel]

Well, I'm still for aborption...though I don't think my position is gonna change something cause it's not me who's deciding that...And yes, sex does have interest and you have sex without wanting a children...we had pleasure over that, a lot actually, but we don't want to have the side effects of course. I still thinks abortion really is the best choice when it's going to be a problem for the baby, I mean, being raised in an environment where he won't be loves, and won't have some decent growth. For chidren who have genetics problem...I don't know, it should be a really hard decision to do, though your love for your futur baby would keep him...but I could understand why people abort it. And actually, about the whole life thing...meeeh, I kinda understand we can consider it like a leaving being even for a cell...but after al, I wil sound a bit harsher than I am, but do we care when we kill a bacteria, or some animal? That's not far from it actually...(and about the soul, I believe in eveything having a soul, not only oour stupid humanity, so...)

[Enjoying Ur Death]

megabuster i'm starting to believe that ur a virgin, no offence dude but seriously. talking about:"don't have sex" only a virgin or sum1 who has never gotten "hot" (trying to stay clean as best i can) would say something like that. boys and girls want sex and want it when they want it. if ur saying don't have sex then ur basically telling ppl to do themselves which is wrong on so many lvls. ppl have sex and there's no way to stopping that. ppl get pregnant and there's no way on stopping that no matter what u do. no matter if u use a condom, take the pill, get ur tubes tied (for both boys and girls), or anything like that, there is still a chance for pregnancy. the only way for a women to not get pregnant is if a man chops off his "partner" which is not gonna happen cuz us men think of sex a lot and want to get sum. with this abortion should stay an option.

[Megabuster]

megabuster i'm starting to believe that ur a virgin, no offence dude but seriously. talking about:"don't have sex" only a virgin or sum1 who has never gotten "hot" (trying to stay clean as best i can) would say something like that. boys and girls want sex and want it when they want it. if ur saying don't have sex then ur basically telling ppl to do themselves which is wrong on so many lvls. ppl have sex and there's no way to stopping that. ppl get pregnant and there's no way on stopping that no matter what u do. no matter if u use a condom, take the pill, get ur tubes tied (for both boys and girls), or anything like that, there is still a chance for pregnancy. the only way for a women to not get pregnant is if a man chops off his "partner" which is not gonna happen cuz us men think of sex a lot and want to get sum. with this abortion should stay an option.

Im not saying that sex is bad, im not saying that you shouldnt have sex. Im saying that you should be responsible for your actions. If you're going to have sex you might have a baby. Thats the purpose of sex, as nature intended, to procreate.

[MangaAddict]

Even if Mega is a virgin, that is perfectly fine at 15. You shouldn't make it seem like being a virgin is a bad thing...
And anyway, people do need to take responsibility for their actions if they are going out and having sex recklessly. But that isn't always the case for people who accidentaly get pregnant.
Oh and who cares what nature intended? People are far more advanced mentally than other animals. They have sex to express love and for fun... not always for babies.

[Drunkenvalley]

@Whoever tries to say abortion is murder -
Actually try and do this:
Write two stories.

First a story of love. One that does involve sex. Put emphasis on things like why they have sex with each other.

Secondly write a story about the girl who got pregnant with a child she really doesn't want. A popular girl with the utmost fantastic reputation and life situation, suddenly ruined by the fact that she has a goddamn stomach the size of a football at an early age.

Just do it. Really get into her situation and emotions while you write. I mean it.

You may want to research things though before you go at it.

Once you're done, post the stories wherever and link me to it. Before you do that I am going to
completely ignore anything you say here as it's clear you don't really understand the situation they're going through and using textbook answers.

Now, you may go ahead and call this post an unrelated rant, but let me ask you something:
If you seriously write a story, do you not attempt to understand what the characters feel?

This is information I have tried to digest in my head when thinking about abortion: What is the peoples' situations like to have something like a football-stomach like?

[RhyssaFireheart]

That still does not rule out the fact that someone can take every precaution possible and still have something happen to get the woman pregnant. If that was not their intent, then yes, she should be allowed to decide on an abortion. The option for abortion needs to be legal and available. It doesn't matter what reasons the women who choose abortion have, they still need to have the option to choose.

I've already said this, but if the nature of sex was only for procreation, then women would only have estrus periods 1-2 times a year. Since a normal, healthy woman these days has on average 13 periods a year, that is 13 fertile cycles. Oh yeah, and sex wouldn't feel good either, not physically, not emotionally, not mentally. If the only reason is for procreation, then there's no reason to enjoy it, now is there?

It's like having the minimum nutritious food in order to sustain life versus having a gourmet meal. Both satisfy the need to maintain life, but one is so much more satisfying.

[Megabuster]

That still does not rule out the fact that someone can take every precaution possible and still have something happen to get the woman pregnant. If that was not their intent, then yes, she should be allowed to decide on an abortion. The option for abortion needs to be legal and available. It doesn't matter what reasons the women who choose abortion have, they still need to have the option to choose.

I've already said this, but if the nature of sex was only for procreation, then women would only have estrus periods 1-2 times a year. Since a normal, healthy woman these days has on average 13 periods a year, that is 13 fertile cycles. Oh yeah, and sex wouldn't feel good either, not physically, not emotionally, not mentally. If the only reason is for procreation, then there's no reason to enjoy it, now is there?

It's like having the minimum nutritious food in order to sustain life versus having a gourmet meal. Both satisfy the need to maintain life, but one is so much more satisfying.

People wouldnt have sex if it didnt feel good. Thats exactly why it feels good. If it didnt then nobody would have sex.

There are very very few legitimate reasons for abortions. If you want to have sex without the chance of a baby being born just get your friggin tubes tied. Get a hysterectomy, if not then bite me.

[methaniel]

Héhé, the thread is really having answers here.
Well, I did say that I'm in favor of abortion, cause I can understand why people need it...but seriously, if it was about myself...then I may want to keep the child. Even if I'm a bit young for making a child growing up with a good life and all, I would still not abadon him. But if the girl I'm with don't want to keep it, I won't protest at all, I understand the problems it can lead too. I was even myslef near being not born, since my mother get pregnant during high school...I guess it was during a party, with a man I don't even know the name (ahah, I don't even ask her what's my father name...), and well, she could have abort, but since I'm here you can guess the answer. Indeed it was hard for her, for her studies, and all these things, but hopefully, she was living at her parents house, so my granparents did take care of me a lot, a replacment for my missing father. But if she would have aborted...I could understand why ( well, I won't be here for understanding...but you get what I mean...), cause it asn't the easiest thing she pass through (hopefully again, she as helped, but for a mother living alone...it can turn out to be hell!)

[RhyssaFireheart]

People wouldnt have sex if it didnt feel good. Thats exactly why it feels good. If it didnt then nobody would have sex.

There are very very few legitimate reasons for abortions. If you want to have sex without the chance of a baby being born just get your friggin tubes tied. Get a hysterectomy, if not then bite me.
You have no concept of the medical issues that women can have by getting complete or partial hysterectomies. And why should it be the womans job to get the permanent birth control option? Why can't men get their testes removed? Don't want to worry about fathering children? Get castrated. It's just as viable an option as telling a woman to have her reproductive organs removed.

Oh wait, you might say, since the woman is the one that gets pregnant and has to carry the fetus inside her, then it's only right that she have the permanent solution as well, right? Makes sense.

If that makes sense, then it's only right that women get to have the right to make their own decisions regarding their reproductive systems and that includes having the right to choose an abortion. It's our body, it's our choice. No one, especially not a man, has the right to tell a woman what to do with her body, not if she is the one that has to go through the 40 week gestation and carry that child to term. It's not as easy as saying "give it up for adoption" either.

[Megabuster]

You have no concept of the medical issues that women can have by getting complete or partial hysterectomies. And why should it be the womans job to get the permanent birth control option? Why can't men get their testes removed? Don't want to worry about fathering children? Get castrated. It's just as viable an option as telling a woman to have her reproductive organs removed.

Oh wait, you might say, since the woman is the one that gets pregnant and has to carry the fetus inside her, then it's only right that she have the permanent solution as well, right? Makes sense.

If that makes sense, then it's only right that women get to have the right to make their own decisions regarding their reproductive systems and that includes having the right to choose an abortion. It's our body, it's our choice. No one, especially not a man, has the right to tell a woman what to do with her body, not if she is the one that has to go through the 40 week gestation and carry that child to term. It's not as easy as saying "give it up for adoption" either.

The only reason i didnt say getting the testies tied is because i believe im mostly talking to women here. I dont care if the guy has to get a vasectomy or the women a hysterectomy. It doesnt matter which one.

[LaughOutLoud]

If that makes sense, then it's only right that women get to have the right to make their own decisions regarding their reproductive systems and that includes having the right to choose an abortion. It's our body, it's our choice. No one, especially not a man, has the right to tell a woman what to do with her body, not if she is the one that has to go through the 40 week gestation and carry that child to term. It's not as easy as saying "give it up for adoption" either.

It's true that people, both men and women, have the right do things to their bodies, but we also have responsibilities with these rights. Just because someone has the right to use a public facility doesn't mean they can do whatever they want with it.

Also in terms of abortion you are directly effecting another person's "body", the unborn child. Does the child get a say in whether they are aborted or not? No. You can't just kill someone to free yourself of the consequences of your actions.

[Owaranai Destiny]

why[/i] they have sex with each other.

Secondly write a story about the girl who got pregnant with a child she really doesn't want. A popular girl with the utmost fantastic reputation and life situation, suddenly ruined by the fact that she has a goddamn stomach the size of a football at an early age.

It is assumed that many people who get pregnant unexpectedly usually never think of the consequences, or that they do it out of the feeling of "love", or "in the heat of passion". Not everyone is able to clearly distinguish what kind of repercussions will come about due to their own actions, probably an explanation of why the problem of teenage pregnancy has never gone away (another one, of course, would be teenage rebelliousness in their refusal to listen to advice-in other words, 'filtered' ignorance-or perhaps in a few rare cases, simple ignorance of what might be if they went ahead with having sex.

I'm never quite convinced with the argument that "Love" is a factor, because it isn't very easy to define (aside from dictionary definitions). Simply put, I don't quite believe that a lot of teenagers an differentiate between love and lust (or passion, to a lesser extent). Let's say you are the male half involved in a teenage pregnancy...If you talk about Love, would you have wanted the girl to suffer the anguish of deciding whether or not to 'cull' her own unborn child or to give birth to him and possibly ruin her own future, or would you hold back so that you get the best of both worlds (Hey, you get to make love to the person you love, and even get a son or daughter when you get married)?

For your second case, I can't say that people who wish to abort are selfish and thinking only for their own future, because that's what they have in front of them and not everyone is able to handle something so unexpected and big as having a son or daughter while you're still studying. The thing is, even if unexpected, as long as there's a possibility of having a child borne out of wedlock (or aborted), why ruin everything you have by doing something that would destroy it? Why not have some thought about the consequences that could ruin your life if you do that?

Now, you may go ahead and call this post an unrelated rant, but let me ask you something:
If you seriously write a story, do you not attempt to understand what the characters feel?

This is information I have tried to digest in my head when thinking about abortion: What is the peoples' situations like to have something like a football-stomach like?

You can attempt, but you can never truly understand because we've never been in that kind of a situation where any decision made can destroy a single life, be it physically or in the mother's case, otherwise. Think of it this way: A reputation destroyed can be rebuilt again, but a life lost is gone forever.

For me at least, I don't go by feelings when it comes down to this, because I won't even pretend that I can understand their feelings, whether they are pessimistic or optimistic about life before them, whether their personalities are such that they can handle something as great as this or just let the circumstances defeat them. I'll go by logic.

[Tensa Zangetsu]

Originally I was up for abortions cause well, if the mother doesn't want something inside its technically her choice whatever she wants to do with it. That undeveloped 'thing' won't be capable of thought, feeling, emotion or whatever so its not like it would protest....

anyways now that I think about it, people can always prevent pregnancy so abortions shouldn't even be necessary not that I think they shouldn't be allowed. I think they should have certain restrictions to why you would get an abortion. I think abortions are perfectly fine if the women had been raped or forced in someway perhaps due to being under the influence.